1. Linda and Elizabeth “Katie” Toupin are missing.

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   • I don’t think Linda’s daughter is an NSD (yet). There are a lot of NSD moms who have SD daughters.

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   • Katie is SD, not NSD.

     But mummy dearest could stack Katies downline to give her a boost.

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2. Another great article about the “prestige” in MK.

   “Building” a National area – it all makes so much more sense now – you need the folks who check those boxes of “own home,” or “has advanced education,” or “has children,” not because they are “the rule,” but because they have more access to credit.

   It took me dragging myself through all of this, swearing off the credit cards (credit card free since December 2022), and realizing I could not “build my business” if I didn’t have credit cards to assist in some way.

   It was an emotional, psychological battle to Just Say No More. I’m glad I did, and I’m proud of myself for being a Quitter.

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   • “….. and realizing I could not “build my business” if I didn’t have credit cards to assist in some way. It was an emotional, psychological battle..”-

     Psychological question: Did you ever see it as you “building someone else’s business”? That that was your role.

     Part of the scam tactics is to get you to think in the first person….that you are the top of your pyramid…never really comprehending that you are the person, to upline, that you are trying to recruit for yourself. (Not sure if I’m conveying that clearly.)

     Being a “quitter” in the MLM scam is an awesome accomplishment. Like quitting: gambling, drugs, cigarettes, gang affiliation, theft, etc., etc.. It really annoys me that they label a quitter as a bad thing. But thats also part of the brainwashing tactics they use.

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     • @Char, it crossed my mind from time to time that perhaps I wasn’t building my own business, but rather helping the upline build theirs. However, as you well know, if you would dare speak a thought like that, well, you are quite negative!! Clear those thoughts from your mind. Who have you been spending time with?? What have you been listening to?? What’s the last company event you attended?? Have you been to a Monday Night Live meeting lately?? Well, that’s why your bee-lief is in the dumpster!! Clearly, it was my fault. Haha!

       Thanks for the kudos – I agree, it was as difficult as breaking an addiction.

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       • One of the many things I am grateful for after my husband’s death, is that my sister in law kept her “successful hun” friends away from me. I don’t think it was solely to protect me as much as it was to protect her friends. I am not a woman known for her tact or diplomacy.

         Her friends are middle aged middle class women. Some have careers in middle management, others are/were SAHM. All of our children have left home. Many of them have the paid off house, two cars, a cottage, all the “toys for big boys”.

         So you understand how they sell the illusion of what a successful hun looks like. Getting my husband’s life insurance me as a downline would not only have opened up my money but the possibility of a virgin downline in Quebec.

         And congratulations, Intrigue on getting the coveted “Ridiculous Downvote” ™. Wear it with pride knowing you upset a MKBot.

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3. I think she should have listed Somer as an additional team instead of including her as part of #5

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   • And she’s actually Pat’s daughter-in-law

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4. These NSD mother-daughter teams keep the grift going.

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5. I love that you used a MK marketing material as an indictment against MK.
   So yesterday someone posted how the money in MLMs *depends* on the failure of the down lines. Do the Nationals know this & don’t care? I know they know recruiting is where the money is, but do they know they need their downline to fail, or are they convinced “Anyone can succeed. She just didn’t work hard enough.”? It’s a little bizarre too me as horrible directorship us, that directors & Nationals would encourage their daughters to join.

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   • Yes, they know. They do it! There have been many stories here of SDs purposely setting up DIQs and new SDs to fail. Why? They inherit the downline which means more first and second-line recruits, which means more credit cards for ordering, which means more commission for them.

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     • @PinkiU you are exactly right. My Sr director “never made it” to NSD, but she has a gigantic bloated unit of consultant-customers that keeps her in a pink Cadillac for a decade +. Lots of “failed” units within her unit, including the remnants of my team. It’s really a fascinating & disgusting process.

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   • “So yesterday someone posted how the money in MLMs *depends* on the failure of the down lines. Do the Nationals know this & don’t care?”—

     Yes. It’s how they get their MLM commission checks. Zero sum game: If I gain, you must lose if we’re both playing the same MLM game.

     “It’s a little bizarre too me as horrible directorship us, that directors & Nationals would encourage their daughters to join.”—

     I would simply advise my daughter to only spend the minimum to stay active. Anyone she recruits, otoh, would hopefully be persuaded to buy the biggest package and compete for monthly goals by ordering lots and lots and lots of stuff.

     “Anyone can succeed. She just didn’t work hard enough.”—

     That sounds so innocent. What it really means is: Anyone can win the race, but you need to trample over and beat the other participants. Here’s a raffle analogy, where one random person has the opportunity to win $1000: 100 people enter and a buy $10 ticket; 99 people must lose $10 for the one to win the $1000. It’s simple math disguised under an elaborate MLM scheme.

     “Anyone can win” is misunderstood to mean “everyone can win”, but they obviously can’t per my above examples. MLM is inherently designed to turn everyone into an MLMer!!!! (player, racer, or raffle playing participant) MLM downline has to lose for that NSD to make her MLM commission check.

     Any truly “successful” MLMer knows exactly how the game is played. The money is in recruiting other players. Someone has to put money in the pot. Instead of putting it straight in, products are used to help disguise the money transfer game.

     *All the above info applies to the “MLM pyramid of customers” and the separate game within that.

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   • Nancy Osborn con me out of money and I tried to take her to court and she filed bankruptcy my opinion she should loose her retirement and being a nsd it’s not fair

6. So Robin Wright didn’t want to follow in mom Gayle Gaston’s footsteps?

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7. One interesting detail is that an NSD can pass down her “personal unit members” to her daughter. If a personal unit member is still in DIQ while a director debuts as an NSD, does that DIQ and her team all go to the daughter’s unit as well? Just curious if anyone knows the answer.

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   • Yes, the whole unit goes to the daughter. Someone in DIQ is still in that unit that is being given to the daughter.

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8. Thanks Tracy. Wow, that could surely boost the daughter up the Mary Kay ladder. I have a feeling we will be seeing another sales director daughter reaping the benefits soon as momma top NSD is getting ready to retire I believe next year.

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9. All the daughters have changed their names after marriage except the fortenberrys🙄 Shouldn’t the keep their maiden names because of the brand value it carries?

   Seems like they dont own the business after all. The only name that matters is Mary Kay.

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   • Nancy Osborn broke me and filed bankruptcy we wasn’t married but she’s the biggest con out there along with her daughter Annaka for people that don’t know I took her to court and she filed bankruptcy she stoled thousands of dollars from me

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